[PQR] Blinded's Assassination Rogue (Updated for 5.4)

[vitalic]

as far as pvp logic it wouldnt be to hard ;p, and not 100% random all the time^^, only thing that could change is openers//burst witch can be made into key binds, other than that you have your normal roto,

And how would you use abilities when the profile is spamming backstab/hemo. It's not like a DK where you are just mongo training one target the whole time doing your PvE rotation, Rogue is a control/support class. And there is not one single opener, if you ask any top player what the best opener is they will say "in what situation?". Neither is there a single burst rotation, it depends on the situation, your talent setup, what classes you are playing with if you are in arena, what cooldowns you have up and what class you are playing against, for example you don't want to stun a MW Monk if you can avoid it.

I'm not interested in making mediocre profiles. I wanted to create something that matched or surpassed the top players in PvE, and if I were to make a PvP profile I would be trying to do the same there. But even if that were possible (which I suspect it's not), the time investment required would be like a full-time job.

If there was enough interest I could release my PvP toolkit, but I'm reluctant to because I know the whole thread would be "can u add dmg abilities plzz!!11".

[jackson27]

And how would you use abilities when the profile is spamming backstab/hemo

Pause function, like any other rotation.

And there is not one single opener, if you ask any top player what the best opener is they will say "in what situation?"

Garotte casters, cheap shot melee. Pretty simple.

Neither is there a single burst rotation, it depends on the situation, your talent setup, what classes you are playing with if you are in arena, what cooldowns you have up and what class you are playing against, for example you don't want to stun a MW Monk if you can avoid it.

There sort of is a single burst rotation as sub. Its only changed if you're running marked for death, and even that is simple to factor in. Abilities like garotte on casters, which can be used in a dance, isn't burst. Not sure why you reference stunning a MW monk too, considering we were talking burst rotation. Also, if you dont have CD's up. You don't burst. Simple.



Not trying to be an asshat. Just saying it like it is. There's been some great pvp profiles in the past (lolomo's old profile for example). And for what it's worth. I've had multi glad on a rogue so I'm not retarded.

[vitalic]

Pause function, like any other rotation.


Garotte casters, cheap shot melee. Pretty simple.




There sort of is a single burst rotation as sub. Its only changed if you're running marked for death, and even that is simple to factor in. Abilities like garotte on casters, which can be used in a dance, isn't burst. Not sure why you reference stunning a MW monk too, considering we were talking burst rotation. Also, if you dont have CD's up. You don't burst. Simple.



Not trying to be an asshat. Just saying it like it is. There's been some great pvp profiles in the past (lolomo's old profile for example). And for what it's worth. I've had multi glad on a rogue so I'm not retarded.

I struggle to believe you got glad with an automated profile, perhaps you could link the one you used and I'll check it out?

You are almost certainly underplaying the complexity, and being slightly facetious while at it. I realised quite quickly that if I were to try and automate my own actions in PvP it would be a nightmare and so I haven't even attempted it. I don't agree with what you said on openers by the way, it's not that binary at all. In a random bg with MfD/Subterfuge for example it's often effective to just Garrote>Cheap Shot>Evisc>MfD>Evisc if the target is in kill range, but in general you'd never want to waste DRs like that.

Instead I use a rather effective utility profile which revolves more around doing reactionary things (like insta-kicking Psyfiends, sapping trinkets etc.), having the profile spamming damage abilities would just get in the way, as would having to use a pause bind -- I have over 60 keybinds, I don't want to have to pause the rotation to use them.

I've looked at the other Rogue profiles and they seem unusable, Disarm on Right Control etc. I don't want to have to relearn the binds I've been using for 3-4 years which I suspect you would have to do to some extent in order to have complete/near-complete automation, there is no way around it. So for me it is out of the question and that is the end of the story really

[starl1te]

as far as pvp logic it wouldnt be to hard ;p, and not 100% random all the time^^, only thing that could change is openers//burst witch can be made into key binds, other than that you have your normal roto,

That's exactly right. except there is nothing to change, no keybinds to add - just open MANUALLY with CS or garrote, and then press MANUALLY the SB, SD or vendetta burst when you need it. same with KS or gouge or blind or vanish or evasion and dismantle so on. while the PQR does the basic rotation.

There's been some great pvp profiles in the past

why past? http://www.ownedcore.com/forums/worl...ue-subpvp.html ([PQR] Rogue SubPVP). works perfectly fine in 5.3

[fddbzz]

Not trying to be an asshat. Just saying it like it is. There's been some great pvp profiles in the past (lolomo's old profile for example). And for what it's worth. I've had multi glad on a rogue so I'm not retarded.

http://www.ownedcore.com/forums/worl...c-edition.html ([PQR] Sub Rogue PvP Profile Public Edition) works perfectly fine and greater the lolomo's

[qq12345]

Just to be sure, if I dont have the t15 4 pc yet, would I be better off using a different profile until I do?

[vitalic]

Just to be sure, if I dont have the t15 4 pc yet, would I be better off using a different profile until I do?

You won't lose any dps by not having the 4 set bonus, or at least it would be absolutely minimal.

The only real difference is that the max energy for Envenom is slightly lower during Shadow Blades, to take into account the fact you are at higher risk of energy capping with the 4pc reduced energy costs, but without the 4 piece you are less likely to enter that situation in the first place.

You could always test the version before I added the 4pc handling to see if it yields any higher dps: Blinded_Rogue_5.3.rar

[fireyugo]

good profile but i get much more dps out of from cuteone's profile tested it several times within raid and on dummy

[vitalic]

good profile but i get much more dps out of from cuteone's profile tested it several times within raid and on dummy

Provide some data if you want your claim to be taken seriously.

Try this new version though: Blinded_Rogue_5.3_4pc.rar

The only significant change is to make Envenom be spammed more during Shadow Blades, I've just seen it burst 250k+ on the Raider's dummy in 512 gear.

[ph34rt3hcute1]

I too find the claim hard to believe as my own tests show vitalic's as better.

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2

[starl1te]

the difference between a perfect profile and a very basic one is always going to be very small relatively speaking. its effect on total dps is insignificant compared to the dozens of other things happening in a real raid that affect dps, as well as the skill/playstyle when comparing different players.

On a test dummy, as long as a rotation uses dps CDs when they up, keeps rupture up, uses envenom at 4+ CPs and spams mutilate - it's doing like 99% of what can be done. the energy pooling, clipping etc all have a tiny effect.

both this profile and cuteone's are quite advanced, so there is no way they have a big difference in dps. and in fact I'm getting the exact same dps (within 1%, explained by lightning proc crits and trinket rng), from both of them after 45 min each on dummy. for (hopefully) obvious reasons it's impossible to compare rotations between different bosses or same boss in different raids.

[Debordes]

Should I use Crimson Tempest? Or is Rupture tabbing better?

[vitalic]

the difference between a perfect profile and a very basic one is always going to be very small relatively speaking. its effect on total dps is insignificant compared to the dozens of other things happening in a real raid that affect dps, as well as the skill/playstyle when comparing different players.

On a test dummy, as long as a rotation uses dps CDs when they up, keeps rupture up, uses envenom at 4+ CPs and spams mutilate - it's doing like 99% of what can be done. the energy pooling, clipping etc all have a tiny effect.

both this profile and cuteone's are quite advanced, so there is no way they have a big difference in dps. and in fact I'm getting the exact same dps (within 1%, explained by lightning proc crits and trinket rng), from both of them after 45 min each on dummy. for (hopefully) obvious reasons it's impossible to compare rotations between different bosses or same boss in different raids.

Yes that is true, the small little optimisations will very often be outweighed by RNG, and also what is optimal in simulation/theory is not even going to be optimal in practice all of the time. The question is do you want your profile to adhere 100% to theory-crafted best practice, for me if I see anything which deviates from that it bugs the hell out of me.

I just did a few tests of cute's profile and like you said there wasn't much difference at all, over the first 2 minutes I'm seeing about a 5k increase from this profile on average, but strangely cute's opener despite not conforming to theory often bursts higher within the first 30 seconds because it uses Shadow Blades first global. I also notice that if you get a bit unlucky with energy procs while getting Slice/Rupture up during the opener my profile will use cooldowns at low energy which reduces burst massively. I'm wondering if I should add energy pooling for that one specific scenario.

[vitalic]

Should I use Crimson Tempest? Or is Rupture tabbing better?

You basically never want to use Crimson Tempest:

Q: What rotation should I be using on multiple mobs?
A: 2-3 targets: 2x Muti > Rupture. Repeat this cycle on all targets while weaving Envenom to maintain SnD. FoK spam during Envenom.
A: 5+ targets: 2x FoK > Rupture. Repeat this cycle on 3 targets while weaving Envenom to maintain SnD. FoK spam during Envenom.

In some situations like on Tortos you can continue your normal rotation on boss but just replace Mutilate with FoK assuming the bats are in range, I usually just hold left alt to FoK while the bats are in range and carry on hitting the boss, which I think is optimal anyway from the heroic videos I was watching.

[starl1te]

hard to draw conclusions from very short tests because there is massive rng involved, unless of course all trinkets are removed. but the point about the opener is very valid. its burst has a huge effect on the final dps, especially on the shorter fights, and it's the one thing that can be more or less coded into the bot. once a player knows the rotation and how to move on a boss fight, the dps records will come from timing the cooldowns. after the opener, you pretty much have to do that manually.

the prepot and trinkets last at least 20 sec, and of course the current trinkets sometimes don't proc for a while. gloves start with the first CD. maybe within those parameters the opener can be tweaked to start vendetta with max energy and still fit all of SB into the agi procs. honestly the easiest way would be to just fire off everything right after SnD, the energy is very high at that point anyways. depending on relentless strikes luck pooling energy can take quite a while. the other obvious option is to vanish, and maybe even prep-vanish all during the opener. instead of keeping vanish for whatever it's being used for now (which i never understood).

as for tempest, never use it. goes for combat too. it's not really possible to tab-rupture more than, say, 3 targets... so at some point, not sure how many adds, it's better to FoK while keeping up as much envenom as possible. you'd still keep up rupture on primary target.