[Guide] Rogue vs. Rogue PvP

[Sarkor]

Hey,

The Rogue vs. Rogue PvP is at the moment my favorite PvP aspect, so I decided to make a guide about it.

Information: Specc used is Mutilate/Preparation
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The Basics

In Rogue vs. Rogue duels it's all about reaction. If you have a good reaction, you have good chances to win.

You can train your reaction on this page: Fetchfido's Free Online Games - Reaction Test
Just play this game a while, and you'll notice that your reaction gets better.



Macros

I use a few macros, which I'll share with you.

Sap/Cleartarget:

This macro allows you to spam sap, if you search for the other rogue. In my opinion very usefull, because you don't have to TAB-Sap.
Looks like this:

#show sap
/cleartarget
/targetenemy
/cast sap

Mutilate/Startattack:

A simple macro which allows you to autoattack your target, if you don't got enough energy to mutilate.
Looks like this:

#show mutilate
/startattack
/cast mutilate

Cheap shot/Switch mainhand:

This is in my opinion the most useful macro for a rogue.
It allows you to cheap shot your target if it's sapped, whitout breaking sap.
So you can sap -> cheap shot -> restealth -> reopen.
The only thing you need, is a second mainhand. It doesnt have to be a dagger, you just have to equip it and reequip you usual mainhand.
Looks like this:

/equip Name of your second mainhand
/cast cheap shot
/stopattack
/equip Name of your usual mainhand

Preparation

This is another little useful macro. If you use preparation, it activates the cooldowns which you didn't used.
Looks like this:

#show preparation
/cast Sprint
/cast [nostealth] Evasion
/cast preparation


If you got Opener

Here I advice you an Addon: Miks Scrolling Battle Text
(download: MikScrollingBattleText - Addons - Curse)
Why is this useful?
You see if the opponent get the buff of the PvP Trinket. So you can instant Blind or Kidney shot him.

So back to the real thing:
If you got opener, you have almost a 90% winchance against bad rogues.
But a good rogue will beat you, if you don't watch over.

I advice you to open with cheap shot.
Now you will need a quick reactiontime:
The rogue will use his trinket in your stun.

If you see this buff:

Blind, Gouge or Kidney shot him.
If you were quick enough, you and your oponent are blinded.
Now simply use you trinket and reopen.

If you Kidney shoted, dps a bit and blind after the Kidney shot. Now just restealth, sap and dps till he dies.

If you blinded, just restealth and dps.

If you Gouged, vanish and reopen

This should be a win.



If you not got opener

This will get a hard, but it's possible.

So let's say, your enemy opens whit Cheap Shot.
Wait till the Cheap Shot is over. The other Rogue will Kidney Shot.
So if you see the Kidney Shot, instantly use your trinket.
The other Rogue will have a Global Cooldown on Blind, so you're safe for a moment.

Now you can go a few ways:

First way: Blind.

If you blind, wait till you see this buff on your enemy again:

Now you need a quick reaction time again.
If you see the buff, instantly use vanish, because the enemy rogue will blind.
If you were fast enough, you will be in stealth and the other rogue will have his Blind on cooldown.
If you were a bit too slow, you will get out of vanish, but the enemy rogue will have his Blind on cooldown.

Second way: Evasion.

This way is based on luck, so risky.
If you used your trinket, put evasion on and turn to the enemy rogue.
He will blind or kidney, so you have the chance to avoid these abilities.
But i think this way is a bit to risky.

Third way: Vanish.

If you used your trinket, just vanish. You have the chance to get in stealth, but a good rogue could get you, so a risky way too.


All in all I'd advice you the first way.

If you succesfully gone one of these ways, the rogue with the better gear(:x) and/or the better stun timing will win.


Movie
This is a short movie I made. You can see a few scenes I explained.
Quality and Editing is very bad.. sorry for that


[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fCsv6Ch0ahg"]YouTube - some rogue scenes[/ame]


I hope this helps a few rogues out there.
Bye and enjoy dueling rogues :P
And.. excuse me for my poor english :>

[Anonymaul]

I've been playing a rogue since 2006, but only in PvE, i always appreciate this kind of PvP guides for n00bs like me. I'd +Rep if i could.

[Earthcel]

Wery well written guide, defenately informative for rogues out there.

+rep

[Blazara]

Nice to see something original that appears to have some thought in it
+rep

[Sarkor]

Thanks guys :)

[HalfSlant]

you should always get a rupture up as soon as possible. I do it before the KS even. This way, if they vanish, they will come right back out.

[manowarlock]

good guide but you miss one vital clue that is to get a bleed on the rogue, that way, as stated above me...they cant really stealth unless they are next to you to cheap shot you...and they hacve to time it right...

[Sarkor]

I'd not use rupture, before the other rogue used blind.
Why?
If you bleeded up the rogue, he can blind you, but you can't blind him

[Eukamel]

Bleeds are pretty shit in RvR right now. Since either one of you will die in a stun it's all about bursting down your opponent. If you get bleeds up he can simply trinket and pop evasion and stick on you for the duration of evasion. While he's unblindable (usually the game is over after you've blinded him with his trinket down, but now he's dotted and thus can't be blinded) he can still vanish between rupture/garrote ticks and get you in a stunlock that will basically kill you unless you trinket. At this point you've both trinketed and have blind up which would put you in the same situation, except, the other rogue cannot be blinded right now. Which will give the rogue who has been opened on the edge, which isn't exactly what we're going for. As to the 'guide' it's really just common sense (after reading some replies I'm starting to realize that it might not be just that). Also you forgot to add that you can also gouge your opponent just as he trinkets if you're fast enough. If you blind you risk your blind getting immuned, which is a bad thing. If you gouge however, sure it could get immuned as well, but it's gonna break his vanish at which point you can simply blind him. Or go for a gouge out of trinket > vanish reopen > blind > reopen.

[Sarkor]

That's true, I forgot the Gouge Trinket thing O.o
Ty, edited it.

[deadfate]

No offensive but this is a bad rogue vs bad rogue guide?
You include nothing about pre vanishes especially againts night elves, nothing on bleeds? The reason you bleed is so they cant re stealth, and you can still get out of distance and restealth from them.

Also when they get opener on you, and you trinket KS blind them, vanish right away and kidney shot, because the second you blind they are gonna trinket

Blind> vanish > cheapshot, he will waste his trinket and sit in a full stun lock which is GG

[noes]

Old skool rogues (2005-2006) will always have a upperhand against any tbc/wotlk rogues due the old skool tactics.

and u cant beat that.

[HalfSlant]

If you bleed the rogue (like you should), you just use the blind on his team mate. You obviously dont blind a dotted target.

[BaboonX]

A cool trick that I use on my rogue is do the sap / cheap shot with out breaking sap trick. Then restealth, and garrote then kidney shot.. and before kidney shot runs out run away, come back, restealth and do the normal stun lock.

[ugot]

You rupture a rogue so when he blinds you (after you get opener on it) he cant bandage/eat.