[BUG] Horde Get Paid To PVP!!

[Fishy80]

ok guys.

blizzard DOES NOT FAVOR ANY FACTION. they would be stupid if they do! if it would be obvisiouly that blizz favors horde or alliance because players of the non-favored faction would stop playing the game. blizzard wants to get their players addicted to the game. this means that alliance and horde must be equal. of course this is not easy because it would be bored if both factions acts an look like the same (same abilities, same looking, same maps, etc...) so OF COURSE every faction hast some advantages that the other faction does not have (pally - shaman, AV there ARE imparities).

so THINK be4 posting. blizzard wants to make the game to everyone as attractive as possible this means no faction, no race, no class, no gender, NOTHING is favored by blizzard.

in a dream world sure... yea... uh huh your right... in a dream world..

down here in the readl world.. blizzard entertainment is run by people... people with opinions... people who like horde more... who enjoyed building the horde bases more than alliance... who enjoyed making the talents for horde more than they did for alliance...meaning of course that they do better work

[zitronenbaum]

if ur writing for a news paper an article about politics, would you write about your favourite party? how you love them? why everyone should vote for him?

i know that you won't because if you would do you will get kicked out of your company by your boss. so you will write a neutral article that is objectiv.

same to the world of warcraft. OF COURSE there are blizz members loving mor horde, alliance or steamwheedle but they must do a 50:50 work. 50 for alliance and 50 for horde

[Nezdragon]

Nez. i wasnt talking of Game lore. i was talking about simple Human mechanics. Horde 'look' Evil. Ally look 'good' its in the color scheme and the races.

Depends on your point of view. My tauren warrior running around with plate slaughtering things looks pretty cool IMO. My troll rogue running around with shiny slashy stabbies slaughtering things also looks pretty cool. My gnome mage throwing frostbolts at things looks pretty cool, but his voice and emote sounds have gotten annoying. So meh.

P.S you are THE biggest geek i have ever come into contact with...lol

Why, cause I copied and pasted some of the lore because I have an hour and a half after school to sit and do anything but homework? Wow, thats pretty geekish... Not.

Boredom does wonders. Next!

I am sorry but every one of your points about AV are not true..

I have read many thread on the subject and made many of my own... Av is built horde sided... (as in the way things are places/built)... note... im not complaining... I think that the way things are its even for the most part... but the zone itself is fashioned twords horde... if you want to dicuss Alterac Valley make a new thread... ill be happy to post in it...

So why do Horde win WSG/AB all the time but mysteriously lose AV a lot more? Please, i'd love to see how it is fashioned towards horde...

as far as flight paths...

what about mulgore durotar the barrens the badlands and swamp of sorrows?? alliance dont get FP's there.. you do... yea...

Mulgore and durotar are newbie's starting zones. Do you REALLY think there would be an alliance base there? If you do, let me know where a good spot in Teldrassil would be for my watch tower.

Barrens actually has a FP for alliance, it's called Ratchet.

Horde doesn't have a FP in Blasted Lands. Alliance does. Swamp of Sorrows is therefore a moot point.

I've figured out that the starting newbie zones (lvl 1-10 plus major city, i.e. Elwynn, Teldrassil, Durotar, Mulgore, etc.) and the zone immediately after that (Westfall, Darkshore, Silverpine, lvls 11-20) are controlled by their faction and aren't contested zones on PvP servers to their respective faction. This means that the only faction with bases and flight paths in those zones is the faction that controls them. The exception to this is the Barrens, where Ratchet is a neutral base for the Alliance, much like Booty Bay, Gadgetzan, and Everlook. I believe this is because the Barrens is a composite 'tier 2' newbie zone between Mulgore and Durotar.

You learn this kind of stuff after playing for a year and/or being very bored for long periods of time.

I am not kidding though, the Horde has one less flight path than the alliance does.

Alliance has 16 FPs in Kalimdor, compared to the Horde's 18.

Alliance has 16 FPs in Azeroth, compared to the Horde's 13.

This adds up to 32 FPs for alliance, 31 FPs for the horde.

This is counting neutral flight paths. The difference will not change if you remove them. The horde has one less flight path than the alliance does. I don't know why this issue hasn't been raised before.

Moving on!

PvE ability's are practically useless in PvP... pvp ability's are great for PvE OR pVp so...who's end up ahead in the END? obviosly PvP side... which is horde..

ROFLMAO.

What level is your main, and how much raiding have you done? Have you ever gone on a 40 man or even a 20 man raid before? Have you ever raided on horde to see if your preformed bias is correct? No, you haven't.

I'm going to be blunt, if you can't tell that already. Let's look at the two shaman abilities you noted before, Earthbind totem and Frostshock.

Earthbind is pretty useful in PvP. I know of no times in PvE where my groups shaman has used Earthbind for anything other than controlling the occasional runner. This job is well performed by other classes. It is completely and totally useless in a raid environment like Molten Core, where most if not all of the mobs are immune to slowing effects.

Frostshock is useful in PvP. In the endgame 5 mans, it can be moderately useful for burst DPS, runners, and such. However, it is also completely useless in a raid environment. Any shaman with experience raiding will spam Lightning Bolt for mana conservation. Look up the spells if you want. Lightning Bolt does about the same damage for about 2/3 the mana cost. If you want to take up the issue of casting time, remember that Froshock has a 6 second cooldown, while Lightning Bolt has a 3 second cast time without taking talents into account. You do the math.

PvP abilities aren't as good in PvE as you may think, especially in raids.

One last thing: PvE abilities that aren't so useless in PvP (pally buffs come to mind) allow for easier raiding. I know, I've seen it. This easier raiding translates to more epic loot. More epics means a distinct advantage in PvP.

PvP abilities, on the other hand (totems and shocks come to mind), don't always make for easier raiding. There is no horde equivalent for Blessing of Kings, for example. Also, 5 pallies can buff the entire raid with all of the blessings (kings, salvation, wisdom, might, and light), and they also have auras. In contrast, a shaman can only give four buffs (earth, fire, water, and air totems) to their party. The restrictions on that are that the party members must be in range of the totems, and they are stuck with what the shaman drops unless they move out of range. This means you must have a minimum of 8 shamans to give totem buffs to the whole raid. Also, pallies can choose the recipients of their buffs, while shamans can't. Different classes in the party may not get the buff they want.

Alliance has it easy with PvE. I'm not even getting into the population imbalance, so don't get me started

[Cypher]

Explain?

Ally vastly outnumber horde on most servers, they are better for raiding and PvP, and on lots of servers they dominate the BGs, especially AV.

[Jimbo]

I've played 5 alliance level 60's, and 3 horde level 60's... And I must say I find horde way more mature.. And alliance to have it a little easier than horde..

First of all alliance seems to have a lot of "zomg gank everyone", while horde is more relaxed..
Alliance side is more like "I'm the best!" "No I'm the best" "No I pwn you!!", and horde just seems more mature, and would say "Who cares?" :P

And alliance get it a bit easier in AV, their terrain just makes it easier, fx. alliance have like one narrow road, while horde has one huge open area at their base. And there's only one way into the alliance base, while there's two into the horde base.

But still I would say it's all things I can live with.

[wanker]

Fishy80 your full of **** im affraid to say. And you do 'this... too... much,... there... is... no... need... for... it...'

[Fishy80]

Depends on your point of view. My tauren warrior running around with plate slaughtering things looks pretty cool IMO. My troll rogue running around with shiny slashy stabbies slaughtering things also looks pretty cool. My gnome mage throwing frostbolts at things looks pretty cool, but his voice and emote sounds have gotten annoying. So meh.



Why, cause I copied and pasted some of the lore because I have an hour and a half after school to sit and do anything but homework? Wow, thats pretty geekish... Not.

Boredom does wonders. Next!



So why do Horde win WSG/AB all the time but mysteriously lose AV a lot more? Please, i'd love to see how it is fashioned towards horde...



Mulgore and durotar are newbie's starting zones. Do you REALLY think there would be an alliance base there? If you do, let me know where a good spot in Teldrassil would be for my watch tower.

Barrens actually has a FP for alliance, it's called Ratchet.

Horde doesn't have a FP in Blasted Lands. Alliance does. Swamp of Sorrows is therefore a moot point.

I've figured out that the starting newbie zones (lvl 1-10 plus major city, i.e. Elwynn, Teldrassil, Durotar, Mulgore, etc.) and the zone immediately after that (Westfall, Darkshore, Silverpine, lvls 11-20) are controlled by their faction and aren't contested zones on PvP servers to their respective faction. This means that the only faction with bases and flight paths in those zones is the faction that controls them. The exception to this is the Barrens, where Ratchet is a neutral base for the Alliance, much like Booty Bay, Gadgetzan, and Everlook. I believe this is because the Barrens is a composite 'tier 2' newbie zone between Mulgore and Durotar.

You learn this kind of stuff after playing for a year and/or being very bored for long periods of time.

I am not kidding though, the Horde has one less flight path than the alliance does.

Alliance has 16 FPs in Kalimdor, compared to the Horde's 18.

Alliance has 16 FPs in Azeroth, compared to the Horde's 13.

This adds up to 32 FPs for alliance, 31 FPs for the horde.

This is counting neutral flight paths. The difference will not change if you remove them. The horde has one less flight path than the alliance does. I don't know why this issue hasn't been raised before.

Moving on!



ROFLMAO.

What level is your main, and how much raiding have you done? Have you ever gone on a 40 man or even a 20 man raid before? Have you ever raided on horde to see if your preformed bias is correct? No, you haven't.

I'm going to be blunt, if you can't tell that already. Let's look at the two shaman abilities you noted before, Earthbind totem and Frostshock.

Earthbind is pretty useful in PvP. I know of no times in PvE where my groups shaman has used Earthbind for anything other than controlling the occasional runner. This job is well performed by other classes. It is completely and totally useless in a raid environment like Molten Core, where most if not all of the mobs are immune to slowing effects.

Frostshock is useful in PvP. In the endgame 5 mans, it can be moderately useful for burst DPS, runners, and such. However, it is also completely useless in a raid environment. Any shaman with experience raiding will spam Lightning Bolt for mana conservation. Look up the spells if you want. Lightning Bolt does about the same damage for about 2/3 the mana cost. If you want to take up the issue of casting time, remember that Froshock has a 6 second cooldown, while Lightning Bolt has a 3 second cast time without taking talents into account. You do the math.

PvP abilities aren't as good in PvE as you may think, especially in raids.

One last thing: PvE abilities that aren't so useless in PvP (pally buffs come to mind) allow for easier raiding. I know, I've seen it. This easier raiding translates to more epic loot. More epics means a distinct advantage in PvP.

PvP abilities, on the other hand (totems and shocks come to mind), don't always make for easier raiding. There is no horde equivalent for Blessing of Kings, for example. Also, 5 pallies can buff the entire raid with all of the blessings (kings, salvation, wisdom, might, and light), and they also have auras. In contrast, a shaman can only give four buffs (earth, fire, water, and air totems) to their party. The restrictions on that are that the party members must be in range of the totems, and they are stuck with what the shaman drops unless they move out of range. This means you must have a minimum of 8 shamans to give totem buffs to the whole raid. Also, pallies can choose the recipients of their buffs, while shamans can't. Different classes in the party may not get the buff they want.

Alliance has it easy with PvE. I'm not even getting into the population imbalance, so don't get me started

lol **** it, I dont care about the AV **** anymore, ya know what? horde lose cause they dont know how to play AV correctly... untill the cross realm BG's alliance ALWAYS lost AV on my server... so whatever I'm not making another comment on AV...
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the fight paths... who the hell gives a ****? I was just being (kinda) sarcastic about the effing noob zone flightpaths... ZOMG ALLIANCE HAVE 1 MORE FP!

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ok, about the PvE and PvP ability's...

I'll let ya know that my main is a 60 warlock, my guild just started naxx yesterday (death knight wing) so... now that I got that outta the way...

I will admit that I have not raided on a horde to prove it...
first, let me remind ya that that whole thing started about RACIAL ability's, not all their ability's... frost shock and such I was posting as a response to the guy talking about alliance's ANNOYING ability's..and you didnt mention ONE racial, which is all I was talking about

well after posting all the horde ones, and then as I was about to post the alliance ones, I realized that the alliance racials are pretty useless in PvE

horde can be used in both... but when is shadowmeld or perception gonna be any good in PvE? horde's can be used... alliance are kinda... worthless... except stoneform and MAYBE escape artist... so whatever...
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and hey "wanker" you can go **** yourself, I'll... all... I... ****ing want, and thers not a thing you can do about it

got...that?... yea... thats... what... I... Thought....*******...
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and to jimbo, thats is not completley true, it depends on the individual player/guild...

my entire guild is pretty mature, I admit, I see a horde... I gank it... but thats just me, I feel pvp on a pvp server makes sense.

nobody in my guild really starts trying to be better than everyone else...

and, again, im not gonna go into AV as there are too many things I cant post due to blizzard having deleted my threads on them and I dont feel like figuring it all out again for this...

posting here on problems with AV or whatever is just complaining, there is absolutley nobody here than can fix the AV problems or whatever balance issues you may have... so complaining about them here is doing nothing but complaining...

[KOLOSSAL]

Everyone who wishes to flame instead of contribute to thread gtfo please.

[GLrunner13]

Explain?

IMO, much easier to raid with Alliance, and all I do is PvE. First of all look at progression threads on all new forums, Alliance is way ahead of Horde. Paladins are a HUGE asset to raiding and on some encounters so are Dwarf Priests. Fear ward, all the blessings, etc. Personally I don't mingle much in the PvP aspect of the game but in PvE, alliance have it easier.

[Poopdog]

Zomg Horde Ftw!

[wanker]

and hey "wanker" you can go **** yourself, I'll... all... I... ****ing want, and thers not a thing you can do about it

got...that?... yea... thats... what... I... Thought....*******...

Love how Fishy went off on one like an old lady who just descovered a used condom on the street. LMAO!

Look here it is again go on have a laugh while noone is looking.

and hey "wanker" you can go **** yourself, I'll... all... I... ****ing want, and thers not a thing you can do about it

got...that?... yea... thats... what... I... Thought....*******...

Cry more please...

Notice in my original post how i mention alliance fp's? i do admit i forgot Badland's wich i might add we share with alli questwise oh and swamp of sorrows thats great yeah... for bout 5 quests? and not to mention they stick a lvl 50+ instance zone in the middle of a lvl 35 horde place.

Now what about The Barrens? hmm let me see its a lvl 10 ish zone, horde territory you know like Westfall, Darkshore and Dun Morogh are to alli? how many of those have a fp in them for horde? -
Im not here to argue over who has more fp's, if you had thaught about my first post then maybe you would realise that i was stating out alli having it easier than horde during lvling times since low to mid level - leveling grounds for alli are much more secluded than the horde and do not have little things like a fp or instanced zone that would churn out high level alli into the zone to gank every lower level horde they see along the path to wherever it is they are going.

and hey "wanker" you can go **** yourself, I'll... all... I... ****ing want, and thers not a thing you can do about it

got...that?... yea... thats... what... I... Thought....*******...

LOL!!

[rudez]

hmm well i play allaince and i say HORDE PWN'S PVP ON MY SERVER but then again I pwn horde so i dont care LOL.

also may i just say its ok 2 pay out ppl who you seriously despise but fishy, wanker, EVERYONE, Make LOVE not WAR!? seriously ppl this isnt ****ing vietnam, as all know kokoda can be related 2 AV because the veitnamese (bad guys, horde) had the advantage over the americans (good guys in our eyes, allaince), but THATS NOT THE POINT. Look ppl, what i am trying to say is you're all beutiful in your own way, now remember that, cherish that, hold onto that when there is nothing left, because there is someone out there who loves you and they care because they can! Now go follow your dreams. Become the 1337-est person in wow because i believe you can.

Peace out!

[Borr]

Hehe, there are a lot of immature people on both sides, I can tell ya. But what is a bit annoying is the ridicolous advantages alliance has over horde in raiding.

JoW+BoW=Infinite mana on everyone removing all challenge in mc for a badly geared raid.

Fear ward=Self explantory.

Blessing of salvation=removes all challenge in bwl.

And as of some strange coincidence, the first fight in bwl that is not made easymode by BoS, is made easymode with Cleanse, since all debuffs can be removed at once without any mana congestion.

Apart from those things that removes most skill:

With descent gear and BoL a paladin can spam FoL into litterary infinity. Blessing of Kings almost makes flask of titans a waste and boosts the raid enourmously. Most of the blessings are more powerful than shaman totems, and can be put on the whole raid at once, while a totem is only for the party, small radius, and weak (the exception being windfury).

I'm sure there are even more things, but whatever.

[Sypher]

Earthbind is pretty useful in PvP. I know of no times in PvE where my groups shaman has used Earthbind for anything other than controlling the occasional runner. This job is well performed by other classes. It is completely and totally useless in a raid environment like Molten Core, where most if not all of the mobs are immune to slowing effects.

Frostshock is useful in PvP. In the endgame 5 mans, it can be moderately useful for burst DPS, runners, and such. However, it is also completely useless in a raid environment. Any shaman with experience raiding will spam Lightning Bolt for mana conservation. Look up the spells if you want. Lightning Bolt does about the same damage for about 2/3 the mana cost. If you want to take up the issue of casting time, remember that Froshock has a 6 second cooldown, while Lightning Bolt has a 3 second cast time without taking talents into account. You do the math.

how many times have you done BWL? the very first boss on of the main strats is to get shammies Kiting mobs using Earthbind totem and frost shock not useful? lol

EDIT: typos ftw

[Jimbo]

how many times have you done BWL? the very first boss on of the main strats is to get shammies Kiting mobs using Earthbind totem and frost shock not useful? lol

EDIT: typos ftw

Seems like you haven't been there in a while, the mobs are immune to it now