Vitalic Elite Rogue Combat Routine | Classic

[globaling24]

@Explasion Wait i thought HB does not work with private servers :O

PQR not HB.

[joeichen]

@vitalic I just wanted to say thanks for your awesome routine. As someone who has never played rogue, I am up to 2k in 2's using the default settings (with binds only for cheapshot, garotte, blind), lazy mode, auto-kidney, and primarily tunneling the opposing team's healer/dps to the ground as a combat rogue. I usually run SR, BoS, and open with MfD opener. I've slowly improved by reading most of the pages in this thread starting from around page 400 and gleaning as much info as possible from the various regular posters. I think I'd be able to get to 2.2k with a good healer just using the above settings, but beyond that I think I'm at that point where i need to start controlling the CR more rather than let the CR control itself.

So these are general questions for experienced rogue players specifically for combat rogue 2's with a healer:
1) Feint - I noticed from watching some glad rogues streaming that they were really good at always having feint up when being targeted. The default settings in the CR is set up to cast Feint when below 60%. For 2's, is it generally better to increase this to a higher number so that feint is up more often, or will this hurt my pressure too much? Or if I even need to worry about this, then am I running with a crappy healer?

2) Shadowstep - I've tried to run shadowstep, but against some comps and on some maps it just seems really hard to stick to my target (resto druid on Blade's Edge spamming faerie fire). When would using shadowstep be recommended over BoS? Do all high level rogues just use shadowstep primarily?

3) Focus burst - Is this mostly useful for assassination? Against which comps is it best to use the focus burst option as a combat rogue?

4) Peeling vs tunneling - As a combat rogue with healer, should I continue to tunnel a target at higher CR's? When should I be looking out to peel? Should I focus on peeling just before I anticipate opponent burst or during burst? Or should I just regularly throw out off-kidney's while trying to dps down my target?

5) Kill targets - What's the best kill target? I'll list what I've been doing so far (please tell me if at high CR's it should be different)
a) Holy paladin / dps - Try to tunnel pally and if I can't get kill then swap to dps and try to cc pally. A good pally seems to be able to cycle cooldowns to neutralize my burst whenever it comes up.
b) Non-pally healers / dps - Tunnel healer
c) Feral druid / x - Try to kill feral usually to stop clones, off heals, and the crazy burst
d) Mage / x - Try to kill mage to try to stop poly's, but this is tough since they have 2 blocks and are usually blinking and sprinting all over the map.
e) Double dps - Usually the squishiest class. Avoid frost DK's and warriors

6) Assassination spec - I suspect the playstyle is totally different and rather than tunneling a single target, I'd end up trying to generate pressure on multiple targets? Never played assassination but since the speculation is that 6.2 will make it the strongest spec, I'm curious what I will need to adjust.

Lastly, just a funny observation, I think I may have run into another Vitalics user. Both of us ran out and neither of us use our Shrouds, I'm guessing we were both waiting for the other to go first.

[xeomer]

I'm sorry but how do you use vitalic? play on a private server?

[Perelman]

@joeichen

1) You need to able to read the game well to understand when to feint. Sustained damage is seldom the deciding factor, however, a well timed wall (combat readiness) and feint is huge when big damage cooldowns are blown on you. It is the difference of surviving vs dying in a full stun, which means you can "sit" the stun without using your trinket or being able to just survive without one. Basically this burst comes as soon as your healer is cced, and if your opponents are good they will make sure to initiate this burst phase at the exact second. For example, rogue gouges off your feint as the mage deep sheeps your healer, following full kidney on you. A good player can anticipate this and react accordingly. To your aid, you can install an addon called Omnibar, which will show crucial enemy cooldowns of your choice.

So to answer your first question, ideally you need to be able to feint manually in addition to auto feint, much because auto feint never refreshes itself until feint has run out. As for the setting, the default is good IF you can feint yourself, otherwise set it to 90.

2) Step is preferred because essentially its an extra powerful tool. Versus resto druids step is mandatory. Generally speaking, if you are new to rogue you will benefit the most from BoS and pretty much only take step for resto druid matchups. What you want to do against resto druids is to sit on your secondary target and swap to druid with red buff shadow reflection kidney. Make sure only to do this swap when he is out of bear form (forcing him to dispel will make him shift).

3) Tried it a few times and it felt clunky, so personally im not using it. You should use focus burst (if nothing else you can make a macro) and combine it with shadowstep to make your swaps less obvious.

4) Its a broad question and depends on your setup obviously. Generally you want to avoid using kidney shot for peels. Vanish cheap shot off target and following up with a simple gouge does wonders. Throwing a blind on his cooldowns is good if you can also follow up with gouge/cheap shot on his trinket. In general yes, you tunnel healers and only assist your healer to allow him to rotate his defensives more efficiently, especially disc priests.

If you play with shaman or disc, you can safely tunnel paladins. In other cases its often more beneficial to force divine shield/bop by ccing the paladin and swap to him with red buff spree during forbearance. Other healers except resto druid are fine to tunnel regardless of setup.

5) Double dps at high mmr usually means Rogue+X(boomkin/mage/hunter), spriest/feral, feral/uhDK. And then there is Melby trolling sometimes with weird comps like boomkin+/warr/spriest. Vs Rogues who play with a mage, you want to get his trinket early and swap to him later at some point with full kidney red spree. Step is good here if you plan to one shot rogue at one point, if you plan to sit on mage whole game, bring BoS. As always glyph of feint and combat readiness is key vs mage/rogue. Against comps with limited cc like feral/dk you need to be prepared to go peel mode for your healer. Blind glyph is very good for peels.

6) As it stands now Assa will be the #1 spec by far. It is focused around doing 100-0 one shots with vendetta into 150k DfA envenom crits in a span of a few seconds. Outside of the crazy burst, you have good split pressure and the ability to literally spam mutilate for insane sustained damage if you have rupture+deadly poison rolling on 3 targets in 3v3. Realistically this won't be the case. but the potential is there nonetheless.

[Dijitaled]

@vitalic I just wanted to say thanks for your awesome routine. As someone who has never played rogue, I am up to 2k in 2's using the default settings (with binds only for cheapshot, garotte, blind), lazy mode, auto-kidney, and primarily tunneling the opposing team's healer/dps to the ground as a combat rogue. I usually run SR, BoS, and open with MfD opener. I've slowly improved by reading most of the pages in this thread starting from around page 400 and gleaning as much info as possible from the various regular posters. I think I'd be able to get to 2.2k with a good healer just using the above settings, but beyond that I think I'm at that point where i need to start controlling the CR more rather than let the CR control itself.

So these are general questions for experienced rogue players specifically for combat rogue 2's with a healer:
1) Feint - I noticed from watching some glad rogues streaming that they were really good at always having feint up when being targeted. The default settings in the CR is set up to cast Feint when below 60%. For 2's, is it generally better to increase this to a higher number so that feint is up more often, or will this hurt my pressure too much? Or if I even need to worry about this, then am I running with a crappy healer?

2) Shadowstep - I've tried to run shadowstep, but against some comps and on some maps it just seems really hard to stick to my target (resto druid on Blade's Edge spamming faerie fire). When would using shadowstep be recommended over BoS? Do all high level rogues just use shadowstep primarily?

3) Focus burst - Is this mostly useful for assassination? Against which comps is it best to use the focus burst option as a combat rogue?

4) Peeling vs tunneling - As a combat rogue with healer, should I continue to tunnel a target at higher CR's? When should I be looking out to peel? Should I focus on peeling just before I anticipate opponent burst or during burst? Or should I just regularly throw out off-kidney's while trying to dps down my target?

5) Kill targets - What's the best kill target? I'll list what I've been doing so far (please tell me if at high CR's it should be different)
a) Holy paladin / dps - Try to tunnel pally and if I can't get kill then swap to dps and try to cc pally. A good pally seems to be able to cycle cooldowns to neutralize my burst whenever it comes up.
b) Non-pally healers / dps - Tunnel healer
c) Feral druid / x - Try to kill feral usually to stop clones, off heals, and the crazy burst
d) Mage / x - Try to kill mage to try to stop poly's, but this is tough since they have 2 blocks and are usually blinking and sprinting all over the map.
e) Double dps - Usually the squishiest class. Avoid frost DK's and warriors

6) Assassination spec - I suspect the playstyle is totally different and rather than tunneling a single target, I'd end up trying to generate pressure on multiple targets? Never played assassination but since the speculation is that 6.2 will make it the strongest spec, I'm curious what I will need to adjust.

Lastly, just a funny observation, I think I may have run into another Vitalics user. Both of us ran out and neither of us use our Shrouds, I'm guessing we were both waiting for the other to go first.

How are you using vitalics in arena?

[vitalic]

Will be away most of today and tomorrow so limited internet access, heading back to the UK after three months living in Malta. Still no news to report but hearing promising sounds from GS.

[tomatom]

Is this routine working somehow with HB on current live server ? at least outside of arena or it doesnt at all ?

[mihaimyh]

Is this routine working somehow with HB on current live server ? at least outside of arena or it doesnt at all ?

It is working, only arena is not supported with HB.

Trimis de pe al meu SM-G900F folosind Tapatalk

[seqway]

ok, theres no way this is not working in arena. im facing rogues that are insta keyboard turnning deadly throwing, at 2200. theres no way. someone please say the work around

[vitalic]

@seqway Even if there was a workaround it won't work as soon as 6.2 drops, but I am guessing they are using cracked HB.

[Perelman]

@seqway Even if there was a workaround it won't work as soon as 6.2 drops, but I am guessing they are using cracked HB.

Sad panda ;(

[Taran32]

@seqway Even if there was a workaround it won't work as soon as 6.2 drops, but I am guessing they are using cracked HB.

Not to mention cracked HB = MUCH higher ban chance anyway so it's kind of pointless for said Rogues to even be using it. They'll likely get a Perma or a 6 month within a few weeks regardless
.

[mmilla]

Edit: nvm this

[Raymond Leeuw]

anyone of you using the cracked version ?

i found on internet now how to do it.. dunno if its wise.. and yes probably till 6.2 it only works :O

[mihaimyh]

anyone of you using the cracked version ?

i found on internet now how to do it.. dunno if its wise.. and yes probably till 6.2 it only works :O

Troll [emoji3]