Rogue Subtly PvP Guide!

[m222109]

Super mega awesome guide I wrote, have fun reading it :P



Rogue PvP Guide!

Table Of Contents!

1) Sub PvP Overview

2) Rogues And You

3)Spec/Glyphs

4)Gear/Gems/Refordging

5) Ablities and you

6)Hemo vs Backstab

7)Comps

Macros

9) VS Classes!

10) Leveling

11) Conclusion/hints/helpful links

I am not going to on about how much mutilate sucks or what kind of exp. I have, if you wanted something like that then this is not the guide for you.

1) Rogues from the Vanilla to now have arguably been all about control and how to stop the enemy from either moving or attacking, they also have been able to dish an acceptable amount of damage when the stars line up and they have somebody in a smokebomb.

2) To be able to correctly play a rogue you MUST understand that you will not always be at the top of the damage meters or have the most killing blows in the bg or arena match. But you will be the class that will be able to solo fc's in a smoke bomb and stop the enemy from completely destroying the other team.

3) To say the least Backstab is in a better spot then Hemo, now there are reasons for this that I will cover later but for right now I will provide you with a couple of specs. that I have used over a while and I will list there benefits. These are only going to be backstab specs.

WoW Talent Calculator - Sigrie.

Strengths: This spec is a the spec that will deal the most amount of damage in a short period of time and be generating a lot of combo points via HAT.

Weakness: Now with this spec you can easily be targeted and bursted down, now this comes from not having any in Cheat Death. Yes it can be a glitchy talent but it has saved my life countless times before.

Overview: Only take this spec if you are not the main target or just want to steam roll in some bg's but take a lot of damage in the process.

WoW Talent Calculator - Sigrie.

Strengths: This spec take both HAT and Cheat Death, this means that you can easily deal damage but can be in a less then favorable position and not have to worry about dying.

Weakness: Now with this spec you are dropping both Waylay and Nightstalker, this means that you will be slower while stealthed and will have a longer CD on stealth, you also lose the waylay effect.

WoW Talent Calculator - Sigrie.

Strengths: This spec is a spec that can take a lot of damage but will not really put that much pressure with the loss of burst due to not having Imp. Ambush and Puncturing Wounds.

Weakness: Like said before this spec only can take a lot of damage, should really only be used in a triple dps comp with you being the kill target.

Glyphs!

You should be using the glyphs from this spec for optimal performance.
WoW Talent Calculator - Sigrie
All the glyphs besides Blurred Speed are mandatory.

You can not miss 40% bleed debuff as it procs Sang. Wounds, which is 16% more damage.

You can also not get rid of 2Secs in Shadow Dance as it can help you get that extra sap or garrote off.

Backstab is for 5 more energy when you crit, just making crit as more valuable.

Blind is for when you want to blind a target with any dots ticking on them and you want the 8 Second fear that blind gives.
Preparation is for another Smoke Bomb and Dismantle, the kick is just a little bonus as I have never used kick in such quick succession.

4) Now this gear set is one that I use, now this does not mean yours will be exactly the same. This build is just a very heavy crit build with around 4.2k resil. At the moment she is around 38% crit, but for some reason it is not the same in the link that I am posting.
chardev 8 - WoW Cataclysm

If you would like you can play around with it but I am going to as much crit as possible while not trying to hit the exp. cap, but you can always hit it if you want. As always you need to be hit capped, with the build I posted you are the closest possible without going over and getting as much crit as possible.

Yes there are benefits to being exp. capped but after playing around with it I found out that it really is not that beneficial, it should be used for those who REALLY hate being dodged or those with a very bad connection and can not stay behind the target.

Also you can go for a haste build in which case you would go for all haste gear, gems and refording. Now I HIGHLY do not recommend this kind of build because if you get nova'd for a couple of seconds then you are going to get energy capped and have it go to waste. You also will crit a lot less making the backstab glyph almost a waste along with the Puncturing Wounds glyph.

Gear priority is as follows, Agi>Hit Cap>Crit>Exp Cap>Haste>Mastery, anything else is not worth having and mastery is barely up there it's that bad.

5) Abilities!

So by now you should know that rogues do not have a rotation, if you think they need one or have one then by all means re-roll because they do NOT!

To be successful as a rogue you have to know several things. To be able to deal enough damage to put pressure out and not be energy starved all the time you HAVE to have Recuperate up at all times, no matter what. Now there are some exceptions but those are near death situations where your healer might die or you will so take it with a grain of salt.

Next you must have a bleed up on your target be it yours or a warrior's or feral's it does not matter just make sure one is on your target.

Now the normal priority is Recup>Silence>Find Weakness>SnD> Expose Armor.

Now it might be a little different with having a bleed or find weakness up as you might be at a point where your target is about to die and one more ambush will kill them, by all means do it, if not keep a bleed up! The reason that Find Weakness is up is because with it you get 70% armor penetration meaning that 70% of the targets armor is gone and with that you should be doing more damage then having Sanq. Veins up, but it is more preferred to have both up.

The opener of a rogue is one that differs depending on what you are fighting so you always have to be on your toes on what classes/comps you are fighting.

Openers are as such, if the class is a healer or spell caster then it is ideal to put up a garrote on the target as it will silence them and put a bleed up to get some quick pressure going. If the class is a meele dps class then it is best to get a Cheap Shot on the target from stopping them from moving or fearing you off or using any get away tactics they have.

You will NEVER start off with an Ambush on the target unless they are at 4% health if not then do NOT do it!

Being a rogue you will have to do a mental check of the arena field at all times to know when to go offensive or go/stay defensive. Some things to keep in mind, is your healer, you or your other arena partner in trouble? If so then proceed to lock down the whole team, this can be achieved by redirecting a full kidney on the most dangerous enemy then gouging the other person if possible use disarm when the most dangerous person is out of a kidney to keep them from attacking. If they are at 90% health or more and have there cooldowns up then either line up a kill or proceed to push out as much pressure as possible while keeping the other team slowed or barley moving .

For poisons is depends on the comp you are playing. But if you are playing a comp that has a 30% go with Wound/Crip/Crip, if not then it should be Mind Numbing/Crip/Crip.

6) Hemo Vs. Backstab!

So here I am going to discuss the pros and cons of Hemo and Backstab. Now I know that there is going to BUT BUT BUT's in this but this is only my point of view and NOTHING more, I am not saying you have to play a certain spec but this is a unbiased point of view on the issue.

Hemo Spec.

Pros: First off this spec is not reliant on being behind the target as you would have to be with backstab. Second you would be having a greater amount of uptime on the target as you would have less gaps in where you would have no energy to backstab. You also would have greater "burst" but this would only be in Shadow Dance as you Eviscerate when you have 5cp, and if you are specced right you would have a higher chance to crit with it. You would also pick up all surv. talents including Imp. Recuperate.

Cons: Outside of Shadow Dance you will only be putting out mediocre constant damage and that is if you are on the target 100% of the time and with the way Cata is at the moment this is a biggy. You really don't notice but you have less reasoning to be behind the target, now this sounds good but when you think about it, it's pretty bad. This could put you in a mindset of "why be behind them" and this could lead you to having your Disarms and Gouges to be dodged and parried.

Overview: Unless you have a terrible connection do not play Hemo. I am not saying to play it because it sucks horrible but because you will do noticeably better if you play Backstab spec. Right now they are pretty neck and neck but Backstab is ahead by number's wise 7-10%, now this might not look like a big number but it can be the deciding factor in hitting 2.2k or not. Also please do not say "Mercader played the spec! awgnoaogna", yes this is true but he was also carried by 2 multi-glads playing a zerg the healer comp like TSG.

7) Here is going to be a list of SUCCESSFUL comps that include a rogue.

RLS

RMP

RMS

R/dk/healer

Rogue/dk/ret

R/sp/Rdruid

If you have any others then please post them!

Macro's!

Here are some of my Macros that I pretty much use every day

Tricks of the Trade on a friendly target:
Replace name with the name of the target that you want to buff with Tricks of the Trade.
#showtooltip
/cast [@name] Tricks of the Trade

Stealth Ability with Premeditation:
Replace abilityname with the wanted Ability.
#showtooltip abilityname
/cast Premeditation
/cast abilityname

Recommended abilities: Garrote, Cheap Shot and Ambush.

Combo Point Builder with startattack and [nostealth] (Add [nostealth] conditionals to every ability which is used out of stealth to avoid barlag issues):
Replace abilityname with a Combo Point Build ability.
#showtooltip
/startattack [nostealth]
/cast [nostealth] abilityname

Recommended abilities: Hemorrhage, Backstab, Mutilate and Shiv.

Sap:
It trys to sap the nearest enemy player.
#showtooltip
/cleartarget
/targetenemyplayer
/cast Sap

Focus Redirect and Focus Kidney Shot after that:
#showtooltip
/castsequence [@focus] reset=20 Redirect, Kidney Shot

Improved Preparation :
#showtooltip Preparation
/castsequence reset=10 !Sprint,null
/stopcasting
/cast Preparation

Blind Arena Target 1/2/3/4/5:
Replace X with 1,2 or 3.
/cast [@arenaX] Blind


Focus Arena Target X:
It's a fast and good way, to manage the focus targets in arena. (You have to replace X with 1,2 or 3 per macro)
/focus arenaX

You can drop Blind arena1/2/3 if you use this macros with a focus blind macro.
Obviously if you have the spare binds, then it's better to have both /focus arenaX and /cast[@arenaX]Blind macros, but if you don't then the setup above gives you a bit more flexibility.


Shadow Dance:
Activating Shadow Dance on the first use, while in Shadow Dance you're casting Garrote with Premeditation. Saves a keybind for Garrote.
#show tooltip Shadow Dance
/cast Premeditation
/cast Garrote

/cast Shadow Dance

Barlag Avoidance:
Shadow Dance [stance:3]
Stealth [stance:1]
Vanished [stance:2]
Without Stealth/Vanish/Shadow Dance [stance:0]
This macro avoids the annoying barlag.
#showtooltip
/cast [stance:0] Z
/startattack [nostealth]
/cast [stance:3] X
/cast [stance:1/2/3] Premeditation
/cast [stance:1/2] Y


Gouge/Sap:
While Shadow Dance and Stealthed you're casting Sap otherwise you're casting Gouge.
#showtooltip
/cast [stance:0] Gouge
/cast [stance:1/2/3] Sap
Focus Kick/dismantle
#showtooltip
/Cast [@focus] (insert ability here)

A great way to bind focus cast on your abilities.(You have to pick ONE modifier
#showtooltip
/cast [@focus, mod:SHIFT/ALT/CTRL][@target, nomod] Abilityname

9) Dueling Guides!

Here I will tell you how to defeat several classes. Sadly healers can not be killed 1v1 by rogues so I will not list healing specs.

Warriors!
Open with a sap, hopefully they will Zerk it off, if not open with a Cheap Shot to a Kidney shot, they will try and Leap as soon as they do Shadow Step to them and proceed to Shadow Dance and beat there face in, when they pop Recklessness just gouge them and run away and try and get a restealth if you can not just blind them and wait it out, then they are an easy kill from there.

Priests!
Shadow: Start with getting 2CP recup rolling from Prem. then open with a Garrote instantly to a Kidney to prevent them from Fading, proceed to Shadow Dance on them and stop them from casting to Vampiric Touch, this is one of there strongest dots, if they get it on you stop them from casting Mind Blast or Mind Flay, if they do get one off then Cloak it off. When they have Dispersion down proceed to kill them in a full Kidney.

Druids!
Feral: Hopefully you can get the opener on them, if not don't fret it will be okay. If you do make sure it's a Cheap Shot, if they get it, just wait out the pounce then just gouge them when it's over, from here if you got the opener or not just get a bleed up on them and when they start to pump out some damage just pop Evasion, try and save your Kidney Shot for when they shift to cast a spell. As soon as they Kidney them and try and kill them in that, if not just blind and reset.

Mages!
Mages are one of the worst classes to fight in a duel if possible do not fight one, but if you want to try then follow theses steps. First open with a Garrote into a full Kidney and pump out as much damage as possible without popping Shadow Dance, as soon as it is over they will either Blink or root you, if they Blink just Shadow Step and beat on there face even more, if they root you try and wait it out, if not and they are popping cooldowns just Vanish and wait for there cd's to go down, if you do get caught in a Deep Freeze pray you have a trinket and get out of it, if you can stay on them as much as possible!

Death Knights!
Open with a Cheap Shot, into a Kidney, hopefully they will IBF out and you can pop Evasion and wait it out, as soon as IBF is down Gouge them. Then Disarm them and beat on there face, then try and line up all of your CD's and try and burst them down, if they do pop there cooldown's before you do then pop Combat Readiness.

Hunters!
About 9/10 times you will be hit out of stealth by flare, but if you are very lucky just open with a Cheap Shot and try and stick on them without using Shadow Step. If you are getting low around 50% gouge there pet and Vanish, that will stop there pet from attacking you. Then when they Disengage try and burst them down in a Kidney Shot, if they live disarm them and try and stick on them and hope that they won't kite you to death. Tip! If they use Snake Trap try and FoK as soon as the snakes come out so they can not touch you.

Paladins!
Ret: Sadly I do not have too much exp. with fighting Ret's so will only be giving tips. Try and open with a Garrote for these guys as most of there abilities are spells and the silence last's longer then a Cheap Shot. Save your trinket for when they Hammer you not Repent you as Repent breaks on damage and the ret can burst you down in a hammer not a Repent. Save your vanish/evasion/cloak for when they pop cooldowns as they are very dependent on cool downs.

Warlocks!
One of my favorite classes to duel as I will win 95% of the time . Mostly just open with Garrote and wait for when they port to do a full Kidney Shot on them and try and kill them. If they do get all of there dot's and start to fear you then you should Cloak not when they get on but when they start to fear you. Blind if your Cloak is down when they get a fear off and wait for Howl to Trinket and do NOT trinket Coil.

Shamans!

Elemental: Open with a Garrote on these guys and Gouge right after the Silence is over, as soon as Gouge is up get a full Kidney Shot on these guys. As soon as they Thunderstorm Shadow step over to them. Wait for when they pop Elemental Mastery and Trinket to Cloak as this is when they do the most damage.

Enchantment: Pretty easy spec, just open with a Garrote to a Gouge, then keep them locked down, like do not even let them move. These guys will run off and heal during wolves, try and pop Evasion as soon as they do to dodge the Wolf Bash and shiv the shaman, then Blind him when he pop Shamanistc Rage.

11) Here I am going to list the gear you should be using while leveling. For spec and glyphs just do the pick one of the ones said before in section 3.
chardev 8 - WoW Cataclysm

Posions should be double wound for more procs if you are not mutilate. Spec should be Sub. as it pretty much is just Shadow Step, Ambush, Dead, if not then Kidney and spam Hemo/Backstab.

12) Tips And LINKS!

Here are the abilities that you should look out for as they dr with some of our abilities so look out!

Sap/Gouge: Freezing Trap, Hex, Polymorph, Ring of Frost, Hibernate

-Cheap Shot/Kidney Shot: with every Stun but Impact Stun and Brutal Earthstorm Diamond's RNG stun.

-Blind: with Fear effects like Fear, Psychic Scream, Intimidating Shout.

There is a lag between when you Kidney so make sure you make sure your target is on the ground before you do it as they might "Jump" it.

Also when a Warrior charges you can Shadow Step to instantly be where he just was with the stun, easy way to get away from them and stop there damage!

Use Shiv! Yes that "bad" ability, use it when a Warrior uses Berserker Rage or when he has Enrage up, use it to take off enrage's even Vengeance!

Links!

WoW Forum PVP guide if you don't like mine QQ
[GUIDE] Subtlety Rogue (PVP) - Forums - World of Warcraft

Ganking Guide for Rogues!
Ganker's Kit of Ganking 2.0 - Forums - World of Warcraft

Rogue Macro's for the ones that were not listed in mine!
Rogue: Macro Compilation - Forums - World of Warcraft

Arena Junkies!
Arena Junkies - World of Warcraft PvP Strategy and Discussion

Arena Junkies Rogue PvP Guide!
Arena Junkies - World of Warcraft PvP Strategy and Discussion
Hope you liked the guide :P

[Domo Kun]

DAAAAM Lol alot of reading but, will put in time 2 read
every1 will be saying"TL RD"or w/e but dont worry
just take a section; such as a paragraph Take it and switch a color
bright colors hlp alot, and just my opinion to hlp u in anyway

GL Always +Rep

[Found]

If I may add a suggestion, and a little constructive criticism.

1.) Put a period after the 1 <--- and befor the ----> ) as I just did.

2.) Leave more space in between sections, so it isn't as cluster****ish *is that even a word?*

3.) Add some color, and inflation of some titles, like making the titles and sub titles Bold and 1 size up on text.

4.) Make the table of contents better, like this:

Rogue PvP Guide!

Table Of Contents!

- Sub PvP Overview -
- Rogues And You -
-Spec/Glyphs -
-Gear/Gems/Reforging -
- Ablities and you -
-Hemo vs Backstab -
- Comps -
- Macros -
- VS Classes! -
- Leveling -
- Conclusion/hints/helpful links -

5.) Make sure that your spelling is corrected too, and color co-ordinate your contents, to it's sub content.

All in all, nice work, and I supposed I'll +Rep you 4 points to get you out of leecher. Thanks for the contribution Please continue to contribute.




P.S. MAKE THE MACROS LOOK LIKE THIS WITH THE CODE FEATURE.

Tricks of the Trade on a friendly target: 
Replace name with the name of the target that you want to buff with Tricks of the Trade. 
#showtooltip 
/cast [@name] Tricks of the Trade 

Stealth Ability with Premeditation: 
Replace abilityname with the wanted Ability. 
#showtooltip abilityname 
/cast Premeditation 
/cast abilityname 

Recommended abilities: Garrote, Cheap Shot and Ambush. 

Combo Point Builder with startattack and [nostealth] (Add [nostealth] conditionals to every ability which is used out of stealth to avoid barlag issues): 
Replace abilityname with a Combo Point Build ability. 
#showtooltip 
/startattack [nostealth] 
/cast [nostealth] abilityname 

Recommended abilities: Hemorrhage, Backstab, Mutilate and Shiv. 

Sap: 
It trys to sap the nearest enemy player. 
#showtooltip 
/cleartarget 
/targetenemyplayer 
/cast Sap 

Focus Redirect and Focus Kidney Shot after that: 
#showtooltip 
/castsequence [@focus] reset=20 Redirect, Kidney Shot 

Improved Preparation : 
#showtooltip Preparation 
/castsequence reset=10 !Sprint,null 
/stopcasting 
/cast Preparation 

Blind Arena Target 1/2/3/4/5: 
Replace X with 1,2 or 3. 
/cast [@arenaX] Blind 


Focus Arena Target X: 
It's a fast and good way, to manage the focus targets in arena. (You have to replace X with 1,2 or 3 per macro) 
/focus arenaX 

You can drop Blind arena1/2/3 if you use this macros with a focus blind macro. 
Obviously if you have the spare binds, then it's better to have both /focus arenaX and /cast[@arenaX]Blind macros, but if you don't then the setup above gives you a bit more flexibility. 


Shadow Dance: 
Activating Shadow Dance on the first use, while in Shadow Dance you're casting Garrote with Premeditation. Saves a keybind for Garrote. 
#show tooltip Shadow Dance 
/cast Premeditation 
/cast Garrote 

/cast Shadow Dance 

Barlag Avoidance: 
Shadow Dance [stance:3] 
Stealth [stance:1] 
Vanished [stance:2] 
Without Stealth/Vanish/Shadow Dance [stance:0] 
This macro avoids the annoying barlag. 
#showtooltip 
/cast [stance:0] Z 
/startattack [nostealth] 
/cast [stance:3] X 
/cast [stance:1/2/3] Premeditation 
/cast [stance:1/2] Y 


Gouge/Sap: 
While Shadow Dance and Stealthed you're casting Sap otherwise you're casting Gouge. 
#showtooltip 
/cast [stance:0] Gouge 
/cast [stance:1/2/3] Sap 
Focus Kick/dismantle 
#showtooltip 
/Cast [@focus] (insert ability here) 

A great way to bind focus cast on your abilities.(You have to pick ONE modifier 
#showtooltip 
/cast [@focus, mod:SHIFT/ALT/CTRL][@target, nomod] Abilityname

[MuffinCake]

Didnt read everything, looks pretty tight. Way to hard to read because of the wall of doomish text. No idea how much you took from other guides / people, but thanks for trying atleast!
+rep!

[xcrossover25x]

Not sure if you are the same person but: Rogue Subtly PvP Guide!!

[Found]

Oh, lookie there.. thats an exact copy of this guide.

[Domo Kun]

yeahh..... Come out and tell the truth

Simply put, Sad

[m222109]

I am the same person ffs!
I can prove if you want me to, jeez way to quick to judge peoples.

[fandehgo521]

I don't know many rogues who use expose armor..

Also Useful link:
ShadowPanther.net

2s Comps:
rogue/holy pally
rogue/blood dk
rogue/frost mage
rogue/Spriest
rogue/Warr

[m222109]

I don't know many rogues who use expose armor..

Also Useful link:
ShadowPanther.net

2s Comps:
rogue/holy pally
rogue/blood dk
rogue/frost mage
rogue/Spriest
rogue/Warr

That's why I had expose armor at the way bottom.
And 2's suck they can just remove that bracket for all I care.