[Rogue] How to duel as Muti 41/5/20!

[Christian1]

Introduction:
Hello. Here the other day I saw a guide about, how to duel as a rogue.
Here's the link:

http://www.mmowned.com/forums/wow-guides/234600-rogue-pvp-guide-including-abilities-when-use-them-strategies.html

I read the guide through, and I decided to make an better guide.

How to duel vs the different classes:


Warrior:

Arms and Fury
In your opener, you must assure that the warrior wont shout you out of stealth.
To avoid this, simply let him use his rage generating ability(like most warrior does) and stay away until all his rage is gone.
Some warriors start out in defensive stance, which makes them take alot less damage, but it really shouldn't be a problem bursting through it.
To assure that you will get the opener without him destealthing you first, I suggest that you avoid sapping him first, and just going straight for him and opening with cheapshot.

After starting out with Cheapshot / Mut / Mut / Kidneyshot / Dismantle, the warrior will be free, and he will most likely use bladestorm - Therefor I suggest that you use Evasion + Feint + CLoS(if you have CLoS glyph) and just tank it, while you burst him with Mut/Evisc.. If he trinkets any of the stuns, simply counter it by Blinding him and reopen with Cheapshot, but watch out for the bleed effect - Avoid being destealthed by physical DoTs by stealthing right after a tick.

The Deadzone:

The deadzone, is a small space inbetween you and the warrior where the warrior cant melee you, nor cant he charge you.
Kiting him around in the deadzone with Crippling poison will give you the oppotuny to regenrate Energy while he looses some rage - and in rare cases you might even restealth. Except the warrior to Demo shout you, while your walking in the deadzone. If your able to, vanish and reopen after a few seconds, and burst - watch out for bleed effects though.

Protection Warriors:

This fight takes alot of practice and it's much harder to fight a protection warrior than any other kind of warrior. Use the Cheapshot / Mut / Mut / Kidneyshot / Mut(1 or 2 mut here), and rupture him, and walk in the deadzone.
A major part of your damage in this fight will come from bleed effects, and therefor you'll be needed to walk in the deadzone, to win this fight (differs with the warriors gear)

Paladin:

Retribution Paladin:
This fight is pretty luck based.
Start out by avoiding the Concecration, and plant a sap - though the Concecration is pretty easy to avoid by just jumping into it, and Cheapshotting the paladin.
Start out by Cheapshotting / Mut / Gouge / Kidneyshot.
Most good paladins will use Hand of Freedom on your kidneyshot, and cast hammer og justice on you - avoid this by using Cloak of Shadows just as you see him using it.
When he is out of the stun, Dismantle him and burst him - no need to kite here.
If you already avoided the stun, and he uses Repentance on you, trinket it - the faster you end the fight the higher is your chances of winning since if the paladin catches you in a Hammer of Justice you will most likely die before the stun is over.

If the paladin bubbles run out and restealth and same approach - sap for diminishing cooldowns if needed.

Holy Paladin:

Holy paladin is fairly easy - Brainless nuke - trinket stun and use Expose armor if you feel like it.
By using Gouge + Sprint you will in most cases be able to run out and restealth and sap / bandage / restealth / open - though in most cases its not needed.

Protection Paladin:

This duel is impossible for a rogue to win depending on the oppotents gear.

Mage:

Arcane / Fire:

This duel is pretty easy.
Start out by sapping while avoiding being AoE'd out of stealth.
Open with Garrote / Mut / Cold blood Eviscerate.
IF the mage blinks, quickly pop Cloak(if your dotted) and sprint and vanish and reopen.
IF he iceblocks, simply wait and pop sprint and nuke him down, while using cloak if your unable to reach him.
Just DONT allow the mage to sheep you - his chances of winning is greatly increased if this happens.

Frost Mage:

Start out by letting him buff up his Ice Barrier.
Some mages even start out by mounting up - just wait until they are forced to rebuff their shield and open.
Right after the mage casts his shield you sap him - the faster the possible the better. Ice Barrier has a 30 second cooldown, so always wait until he uses his shield.
In rare cases you'll be able to sap / resap letting his shield run out - if he allows you to do it, then do it.

Start out by opening with Garrote / Mut / Cold Blood + Evisc.
If the mage blinks, you pop sprint and vanish and approach him in a small circle, so you avoid being hit by Cone of Cold(which most mages will cast to destealth rogue if they vanish). After that reopen, and then he will most likely Iceblock.
When his iceblock is over start out by gouging him, if possible - If not pop Cloak of Shadows to avoid being Deep freezed - if you do trinket it fast and kick his sheep - If you get sheeped you've most likely lost.

Rogue:

Mut / CombatPvP / Sub:
This duel is pretty random - Start out by spamming your sap macro and see who finds who first.
If you find him, stun him and burst - he will most likely trinket it and blind you - Then you trinket fast and blind back and restealth.. Duel over..

If he gets the opener, your pretty screwed.. You'll have to trinket his first stun and blind him, when he trinkets he will try to blind you, and you'll have to vanish the same second as the rogue blinds - then you will avoid being blinded, but you will also avoid entering stealth in most cases.. Reopen with vanish, and the duel is over..

Druid:

Restoration:

Depending on the druids gear - this duel is impossible.. You might be able to kill a PvE geared druid, but not a semi pvp geared druid - just leave it.

Feral:

This duel is pretty easy.
Most druids will start out in bear form - Avoid his shouts by staying away until all his rage is gone.
Open and start bursting with stuns.
You might have to rup him and use the deadzone if he wont leave bearform - he can pretty easily avoid being slowed by your cripple by entering / leaving form.
Though its still an easy duel.

Balance:

Simply stun them, and Cloak after the stunlock to avoid his Typhoon.
Easy duel.

Hunter:

Marksmanship / Survival

In the opener, you must avoid the hunter seeing you - Hunters have an ability called Track hidden, so approach from behind using sprint and jumping over into the flare and stun him(yeah hunter camping in flare - gg) Remember to disarm his trap though first.

Use Sprint when he leaps and, and Vanish / reopen on his Deterance (Knifes flying around him).

Beastmaster:

I dont have much experience with Beastmastery hunters, since I haven't seen alot.
Start out with stunning and sprint / evasion while nuking him when he is using Beastal Wrath.

I will finish the rest later.....

[Taylor123123]

Nice guide, although i play my rogue as sublety i still found this extremely useful

[raspberry]

"In rare cases you'll be able to sap / resap letting his shield run out - if he allows you to do it, then do it."

That's so lame, just open at any given time, if you can't take them with barrier up, why bother..

Also your rogue vs. rogue strategy is pretty retarded .. WarcraftMovies.com - World of Warcraft Movies, check it out for some rogue videos by Akrios/Mahiko/Neilyo to learn more.

[Pheeew]

haha laughed so badly seriously, you can't really use a strategy for duelling since you never knows what the other player does.

tip of the day: against another rogue as a rogue. use the macro:
#show sap
/targetenemy
/cast sap

if you manage to sap him, open with a cheap shot followed by mutilate till you have 4 or 5 combopoints. At 4 or 5 combopoints rapture the other rogue and vanish and run away since he either try vanish (just a dumb one) or try get you out of vanish with FoK (Fan of Knives). But don't run to far away since you got to be ready with a new cheapshot when the rapture is close to run out, so when you open with a cheapshot for the second time be ready on a trinket + blind by the other rogue since if he doesen't trinket he should die. What you've to do, open with a cheapshot,muti,blind and if he doesent trinket you enter stealth and finnish him off, but if he does trinket just gouge him fast and if you get stunned trinket the KS and finnish him off.

[Christian1]

haha laughed so badly seriously, you can't really use a strategy for duelling since you never knows what the other player does.

tip of the day: against another rogue as a rogue. use the macro:
#show sap
/targetenemy
/cast sap

if you manage to sap him, open with a cheap shot followed by mutilate till you have 4 or 5 combopoints. At 4 or 5 combopoints rapture the other rogue and vanish and run away since he either try vanish (just a dumb one) or try get you out of vanish with FoK (Fan of Knives). But don't run to far away since you got to be ready with a new cheapshot when the rapture is close to run out, so when you open with a cheapshot for the second time be ready on a trinket + blind by the other rogue since if he doesen't trinket he should die. What you've to do, open with a cheapshot,muti,blind and if he doesent trinket you enter stealth and finnish him off, but if he does trinket just gouge him fast and if you get stunned trinket the KS and finnish him off.

Do you play rogue in Wotlk? If you get caught without trinket ready, your ****ed.. Im just explaining what i think is the best thing to do - every tactic is unreliable vs rogue nomatter how you do it..

Dont post your PoV - make your own guide if you want to do that.

[Pheeew]

Were did I say you should waste trinket?

[gtdarkside]

Do you play rogue in Wotlk? If you get caught without trinket ready, your ****ed.. Im just explaining what i think is the best thing to do - every tactic is unreliable vs rogue nomatter how you do it..

Dont post your PoV - make your own guide if you want to do that.

cant take criticism i see, i agree with him m8, i didnt really like your guide. to start dont double mut after CS unless you like wasting perfectly good CP.
+ rep for effort tho

[kusipaa0]

You cant use strategys on duels because u dont know what ur enemy is doing (like Pheew said before) Im not going to say anything about those "strategys" because i havent playd rogue on wotlk YET! but im going to :P...HF

[B ALLEN]

this is the guide that's supposed to be BETTER then mine?

lol

btw the spec is 41/5/25 not 41/5/20.

not even getting into all the stupid shit in the guide "Depending on the druids gear - this duel is impossible.. You might be able to kill a PvE geared druid, but not a semi pvp geared druid - just leave it" is just one that pops out at me

[brazzter]

To be honest, you don't know much about how to play rogue, especially not against other rogues. Theese fights are depending a lot about luck if both players are equally skilled (Who gets the sap off).
Tho, if I ever were gonna write a guide about it, I wouldn't recommend starting with CS. Rather open with Garrote without breaking stealth (by turning around immideantly after casting Garrote, and as i use myself /stopattack macro. Then pop evasion and disarm him and Mutilate, then bleed him out with Rapture aswell. Depending on the situation, if disarm missed or anything so the other rogue was able to get up crippling on you or something, you might pop CoS and Sprint and "kite" him a bit to regen some energy. But never run to far away from him, he might do the same aswell and run away getting a restealth when bleedings is going away, so keep an eye up on the time left of the bleeds.
Therefor you should Vanish and this time open with CS, Eviscerate/Kidney.
The duel should be over by this time, unless you are really bad geared


Just had to comment your strat against frost mages aswell. If you really wait for Cold Barrier to go before opening on a mage, you are really lame.. :nod:

[tifaz]

great defination of deathzone there man
not many people understand this idea =D

cheers although u can always comment on rogue can pretty much a draw in a duel against every class since u will not lose to a caster at all (<3 cloak of shadow) worse case is a reset...
melee is always about when the trinket goes off...:yuck: