Rogue PvP Guide

[Bossman4]

Here is a Rogue PvP Guide.

Stats
First of all you have to build up your stats to how you want to fight an enemy and build your talent tree. On the stats part focus mainly on Agi, Stam, and Atk Pwr. Str is good but you will want the extra Stam to last the extra mile(like Rogues can actually last the extra mile in the first place). Contrary to popular belief Atk Pwr owns. Although Agi is better raw pure Atk Pwr makes a HUGE difference in dmg. The extra Atk Pwr will help to take down the classes with heavier armor(IE: Mail/Plate users). Your talent tree is also a very important part of the whole aspect of PvP.

Talent Tree
Your talent tree determines your whole style of being a Rogue in PvP. There are many different kind of Rogues. Chain Stun/Assasination, Chain Crit, Combat, Subtlety(never met a Rogue that is Subtlety but I have heard of them), Assasination/Combat. Chain Stun/Assasination is keeping your enemy unable to attack back as long as possible while you do damage to them.
*example Talent Tree: Chain Stun/Assasination*
Improved Evis - 3/3
Murder - 2/2
Ruthlessness - 3/3
Relentless Strikes
Improved Kidney Shot - 3/3
Vile Poisons - 5/5
Cold Blood
Seal Fate - 5/5

Chain Crit is constantly hitting your enemy as hard as possible for the entire fight, this also REQUIRES extremely high Agi.
*example Talent Tree: Chain Crit*
Improved Evis - 3/3
Remorseless Attacks - 5/5
Malice - 5/5
Ruthlessness - 3/3
Relentless Strikes
Lethality - 5/5
Vile Poisons - 5/5
Improved Instant Poison - 5/5
Cold Blood
Improved Deadly Poison - 5/5
Seal Fate - 5/5
Vigor

Combat Rogues are a very good choice. They can go toe to toe with other classes(IE: Warriors, Hunter, Shamans/Paladins) because of their abilities.
*example Talent Tree: Combat Tree*
Improved Sinister Strike - 2/2
Lightning Reflexes - 5/5
Deflection - 5/5
Riposte
Dual Wield Specialization - 5/5
Dagger/Sword/Mace/Fist Specialization - 5/5 <-- You may be able to specialize in two of these if you place your talents right.
Blade Furry
Improved Backstab - 3/3
Agression - 3/3
Adrenaline Rush

Assasination/Combat Rogues are my personal favorite. They can do damage and can stun an enemy. It is a deadly combination, but also this Rogue cannot do the burst damage of a Chain Crit or Stun as well as a full Chain Stun/Assasination Rogue.
*example Talent Tree: Assasination/Combat*
Assasination
Improved Eviscrate - 3/3
Malice - 5/5
Murder 2/2
Lethality 5/5
Vile Poisons - 5/5

Combat
Improved Sinister Strike - 2/2
Lightning Reflexes - 5/5
Deflection - 5/5
Precision - 5/5
Riposte

*Note: None of these Talent Trees are the full 51 points and they are not supposed to be. You need some points to add a little of your own flavor to the Talent Trees.*

In-Fight Healing
A Rogue cannot heal WELL. We can heal if we have potions or bandages. In a fight if you are running low on health hit them with Blind and use a bandage(or if a Paladin throws up a shield). A potion is a last resort item, if it gets to this point you may want to consider Vanish and getting out of there. But if you are fairly even on health and you use a potion and you go up to mid health and they are still at low dont run just kill them and keep moving.

DoT
Our DoTs are not very effective. Garrote is great at lower levels(pre-30) but after this your opponents tend to have so much health the damage it does is irrelevant. Rupture is great if you are an Combat Rogue, but the burst damage of Eviscrate or the stunning effect of Kidney Shot dwarf it. If you can get a full 5 point Rupture off the damage will be great against clothes(ie: Mages. Warlocks, Priest) because of there low health, but against heavier classes the damage is not effective.

Poison
Poisons are very great in PvP. Instant Poison is a great instant damage poison, it whittles the target down and the damage is significant. Deadly Poison stacks up to 5 times and does more damage than Instant Poison. Crippling Poison is great for when enemies try to run away(ie: Mages have blink they blink far ahead of you they run slow after the blink you catch up and kill). Mind Numbing Poison = Bane of all Casters. Slows you down SIGNIFICANTLY(40%) on your spell casting and for Rogues this can be the difference between life or death. Deadly Poison is the best IMO because of the damage it can do.

Additional Tips
1. When a Paladin pops up a shield use a bandade and heal yourself.
2. Hit Blind and bandage yourself and continue the fight.
3. Vanish is your friend when you need a quick getaway.
4. Potions should be used as a last resort.
5. When a Warrior uses Retaliation, STUN HIM, Blind or Gouge>KS. It really can make a difference.
6. Never use the Evasion ability against a Warrior.
7. When a Warrior uses Recklessness, Riposte him. Yes he can still attack you but he will be hitting you with his fist, and most people dont keep there fist up to date. You will still take damage but nowhere near as much as you would if he was hittin you with the big shiny Battleaxe.
8. When a Mage blinks after you CS them, Sprint to catch up to them then kick as fast as possible so they dont morph you. This will pretty much throw a Mages whole game off.
9. Against a Druid when he plants you, use Vanish then go at him. This is the only way to get out of the plant.
10. Use a combinations of Mouse/Hotkey clicking. DONT just use one, for this is not fast enough.
11. When a Hunter uses Frost Trap, use Vanish to get out of it.
12. If a Hunter tries to Wing Clip you, Stun him for as long as possible(Gouge is 4 second stun, 7 second movement impairment can severly reduce his time to get into position for the aimed shot). You could also use Sprint and bring movement speed back to normal.
13. When fighting Shamans(unless im mistaken) Earthbind totem doesnt break stealth so you CAN approach a Shaman while he has Earthbind Totem up, just wait for the other AoE totems to go away.
14. Rogues that dont use Daggers may want to open up a battle with Slice n Dice for the increased speed in attacking.

These are tips to help anyone become better at PvP as a Rogue. If anyone wants me to add anything to the guide post it or just PM me it and I will include it in tips(and you will receive credit for your tip =)). Critiscism is appreciated. Critiscism = People actually read the guide =).

This is the intellectual property of Randall Mottwiler(Vashna/Galgaros). If you wish to re post this guide anywhere just ask me(as long as you arent trying to sell it or something), it will be allright.

-Vashna, Troll Rogue, Warlord of the Kharma Trolls, Illidan server

Second Guide
Once again this is Vashna again. This guide is a follow up to my other so far succesful guide on the basics of Rogue PvP. If you havent seen it yet check out this link...http://wow.allakhazam.com/forum.html...81115200&num=7.

In solo PvP a Rogue just needs to take out his target. In group PvP a Rogue has an important job to play. A Rogue has many different roles in Group PvP such as...
1. Scout
2. Hit and Run
3. Damage
I will explain all of these aspects of Rogues in Group PvP.

A Rogue must scout ahead in the area so his party does not get caught off guard. Rogues are perfect for this job because of stealth. Once you spot an enemy party immeadietly report this to your party and tell them to prepare. Check the levels and jobs of all the enemy then formulate your strategy on taking them out. Whatever you do dont get too close so they can detect your stealth. Also do not attack anything. A Rogue fighting a party of 5 = Death.

2. Once your party gets there and the battle ensues a Rogue should once the battle is underway sneak behind the enemies while they are focused on your party,and not you, attack the enemy parties clothes(ie:Priest, Warlock, Mage). If there is a Priest and Mage in the party take out the Priest first. Without the other parties healing they will be at an extreme disadvantage.

3. At this point with the Priest(or Mage) gone you need to focus on damaging the party. Contrary to popular belief DO NOT focus solely on one target. Hit a target a few times then switch to another one. At this rate all of the enemy be whittled away and it makes it easier for your party to eliminate the enemy. If the priest is gone and there is a Mage, Hunter, Warrior, and Shaman/Paladin, attack the mage first inflict high damage to him, then switch to the Hunter. The reason you attack the mage before the Shaman/Paladin is because they are high up on the list of enemies to kill first because of all the damage they put out. The Hunter can deal incredible damage if allowed to do so. A Hunter will most likely target your clothes, so this may be the time to kill him and go on. At this point if your party is winning the Shaman/Paladin is the next target. Without his healing the Warrior will be target practice for your party. But if your party loses your healing(ie: Priest/Druid/Shaman or Paladin) go after there healing for this reason... If you attack there healing the whole party will go after you to keep you from killing him. Then you are a distraction while the rest of your party takes out the enemies healing and kite. This will make the battle more equal. While you will probably die from being a target for the whole party it is a sacrifice you must make to keep your party from being killed in the battle.

Additional Tips
1. Heal yourself if you can and save the healers MP for the tanking classes.
2. Let the party attack first then when the enemy is distracted get into the fray attacking the enemies clothes.
3. Dont focus on one target semi kite your targets in the battle. Fight the whole party not just part of it.
4. When you are acting as the scapegoat for the enemy to attack use sprint to run around the enemy and let the party attack them from the back.
5. Rogues also need to be wary of other Alliance/Horde that will come into the battle with the parties. If you see one inform your party so you can take immediate action.

Like I said before Critiscism is appreciated and if you have any tips PM me or Post them and I will add them to the guide.

This is the intellectual property of Randall Mottwiler(Vashna/Galgaros). If you wish to re post this anywhere just ask me it will be allright(as long as you arent trying to sell it).

-Vashna, Troll Rogue, Warlord Kharma Trolls, Illidan server.

Thanks for reading everyone, Critiscism and Feedback is appreciated.

*Tips from Others*
From Vataro, Eater of Souls, NE Rogue Illidan, Those Without Purpose - I just want to add that you want to make sure to use up combo points on a target before you move on, because as soon as you untarget someone, all combo points on that target are lost. My suggestion would be to get 5 pts on one target, use an appropriate finishing move, then move to the next target. 5 combo pts + eviscerate should take out a significant portion of anyone's health, at which point you can move on to the next target. I don't have much experience in group PvP, but this seems like the best idea to me.

From UnknownEntity, Dark Troll Rogue Illidan, Kharma Trolls- Well I'll add my own notes to this guide from another rogue perspective. Like said above you must analyze the situation very carefully, check casters mana as well, you may want to take down those on zero mana first. Notify the group if you'll notice enemy rogue so your casters should be prepared. Leave armor guys alone and start with an enemy casters/hunters at first. Depending on the enemy classes you should pick your poisons for the fight. My favourite would be Instant Poison and Cripple Poison for group with hunters and casters. You may also want to take out hunters at first cause they die quite fast and don't really show up fight against you, while casters may switch to you and fear/sheep you out of the fight. Use blind powder to effectivly take them out first for a little time which will be enough to take down hunter or other caster. If you have a Coldblood use it with Evis on casters to kill them before they awake from the stun. Basicly the goal is to do most possible damage output on casters, keeping them stunned for as long as you can. Unlike Vashna I would recommend to focus your energy and skill on taking out casters fast one by one. Try to stay a bit away from the main group taking out distant targets so you'll not catch up aoe fear/dmg stuff. Well that was imho, nothing more nothing else.

[azzrial]

you say open up with SND, but remember that u need combo points for that :P

[XeroZ]

mate, subtlety is a good talent tree.. Every pro got a few points in that .. Normal build is 31,8.12 for a dagger rogue.. Dunno about sword rogues

[Glikko92]

I say, Bossman knows his classes eh

[bokyong]

subtelty is the best tree for PVP. Hands down.

[amrican93]

Hey nice!
Can you make some more guides like Warlock pvp guide kthx

+rep Mate!

[whoosh]

6. ALWAYS use the Evasion ability against a Warrior.

Fixed.

...unless you're clearly winning.


"what about overpo-"

hush. lemme finish.
An average rogue, has about 15-20% dodge rate. A warrior is GUARANTEED a few overpowers within the course of the fight so, REGARDLESS of what you do, you will eat several overpowers.

Evasion significantly raises your dodge rate. Warrior will most likely get 2-3 overpowers when you have evasion up. Evasion, 15 sec duration, Overpower is on a 6 second CD.

Now, let's see.

Would you rather...have a warrior do overpower 2-3 times in a fight WHILE eating his white damage, mortal strikes and w/e

or

Eat 2-3 overpowers but dodge his white damage, mortal strikes and w/e.

Exactly.

Also, unless your spec includes AR, going toe to toe with a warrior isn't smart.

Warriors should be kited (rushdown mode)! Or stunlocked (hemo spec).

Use evasion when:

You're hamstringed and you're unable to resume kiting.

When KS is on CD and warrior is in Beserker stance (overpower is battlestance only)

Use it at the beginning of the fight- because...warrior white damage=more rage...

Also, lots of your pvp tips are assuming the rogue is combat spec'd and have ripsote and imp kick.

[Ryuk]

maybe you can do sth for warriors too cos i got a dilemma with mine :P

[bokyong]

Best PVP for Warrior is SM build hands down. Just get a SLow Strong 2 Hander like an Arcanite Reaper or If your a ZG guild, Destroyer of Worlds. Put on Crit GEar and you will have about 30% crit chance in Aggressive stance.

[warping11]

After reading over the guide I find many mistakes I suppose or information I belive to be false. I will go into depth about the major problems with this guide.
1) Using terms such as Crit / Chain Stun etc confuse players.(in the way you use the terms)

And yes I do see you have posted the specs I just think players will be confused as they are not common terms to the rogue class

Eg. Chain Stun could be Premed/Hemo , CB/Hemo , Psn/Hemo , Combat Swords/Maces/Fists/Daggers ( with AR).

2) The next thing...

Rupture is buffed by Sublety talents , most combat rogues are spec'd so that their white dmg is maxed out ( more chance to hit etc.)

Rupture will do more dmg then eviscerate on high armor players/creatures

Furthermore Rupture is a waste on low armor targets.


3. Psns

Also Deadly will only do more dmg then instant if the following is happening.
- its deadly psn rank 6
- stacked to 5
- is not knocked off by any other de buff
- no other rogue is using deadly psn rank 6

In PvP crippling > all unless you want to get kited to death.

4) Additional Tips ( In order)
1. A paladin will just run over hit you while you heal your self and heal them selves to full

2. Note: Dwarfs can stoneform out of Blind

3. Truth

4. Truth

5. Gouge - re stealth and wait tell it runs out ( You can throw in a sap if you want)

6. Never use the Evasion ability against a Warrior.
Any good rogue will use Evasion as they are going to overpower you anyways. Also evasion forces the warrior into Battle Stance if they want to overpower meaning you can gouge with out fear of them breaking it via beserker rage.

7. Riposte requires you to parry their attack first

8. True however CS - Gouge is easy to pull off and much more effective

9. Spider Silk Belt is much better as any good druid will have FF on you already meaning vanish will just remove the root.

10. Truth

11. Not sure what you mean by Frost Trap , but you cannot vanish that quickly. Also the hunter would have mark on you meaning they would just have to flare to bring you out of stealth.

12. Truth however most hunters (good) will spin so that you cannot hit them with gouge.

13. A good shammy will plant aoe totems along with being in ghost wolf when not planting the totems this means you cannot sap them. To destroy the totems.

14. Only vs targets that will last long enough for snd to be effective.

Sorry if you think this was a flame , Iam just making comments on the post and how to better it.


Now on to your secound guide , in group pvp you want to work as a team this means you should be focus firing on a single target.

In groups CC'ing is very important lets take this as an example You + Mage + Priest + Druid vs Warrior + Mage + Priest + Rogue.

Now you can sap their priest and sheep another one of the classes. If you want the druid can root a melee player. Your priest can also aoe fear giving the time to cast sheep/root. And also to do some damage to another target.

Edit: Spider Silk Belt = Spider Belt

And Sap - Cheapshot - restealth = Ghetto Premed which is very effective in 1v1

[blueorange]

i've ssen this posted before, sorry dude.

[Ayamé]

i aint been assed seein it before...i pwn tho

[Ownedbyahunter]

This is going to be my build at 70,(look down) I think all around its the best. (yes I like subtlety the best.) Plus this has 6 new attacks you can use. The faster stealth and faster vanish helps A LOT. You also get the caster killer imp kick. While you get a higher dodge/parry which helps against melee characters. http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/rogue/talents.html?0250000000000000000000050550110050100000000005002531032301010401000

My bad, wrong link...
http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/rogue/talents.html?0050000000000000000000050550112050100000000005002531032301010401000